2005 Sebring V6 (Front end noise)

[Lucutious]

Greetings, I have an 2005 Sebring V6 Touring (4 door). I am getting a lot of noise in the front end. The volume and pitch of this is directly relative to the speed of the car. The sound also greatly attenuates when I turn the steering wheel right, even slightly. I also had a lot of steering wheel shaking when I reached 65-75 mph. All indications pointed me to a bad wheel bearing. I replaced the left front wheel bearing, as that is primarily where the sound was coming from. It was also evident that the bearing was bad as the front left wheel would rock when it was lifted by a jack and stands and the steering wheel locked. Replacing the wheel bearing got rid of the shake at high speed, but did nothing for the noise. I honestly have no clue what the noise could be from. The attenuation when turning right screams wheel bearing to me, but that obviously wasn't the issue. (Although it was bad as the high speed shaking went away.) Now I'm sitting here wondering what the heck it could be. I think that it's not the transmission for two reasons: 1) My next door neighbor helped build Certified Transmission, a midwest repair shop specializing in transmissions. He's been doing this for 30+ years, and when it comes to transmissions I trust his judgement. He literally works on them every day. 2) When I'm at speed and the noise is really obvious I can slip the car in neutral and the sound doesn't change. Additionally, I can be at a dead stop, put the car in neutral and rev the engine and not hear the sound. (Disclaimer: Sorry for the horrible description of these parts - my auto knowledge is somewhat basic although I'm not mechanically stupid.) Right now I'm thinking it may be the front right bearing as well, but that would not explain the sound appearing to generate from the driver's side of the car - or at least more driver's side than passenger's side. The other thing I've thought about is the part of the transmission that ALWAYS spins when the car is moving, even if the car is in neutral. I know there's a part of the transmission that directly connects to the wheels. It would make sense that that part would have bearings, and as such they may be going out and have no real change in the shifting/acceleration/deceleration performance of the vehicle. Is there anything I'm missing? Unfortunately this is my only vehicle so I cannot be out of a car for very long. I can probably entice my neighbor to help me take the transmission out and look at it this weekend if absolutely needed, but I just have this gut feeling that it's not in the transmission. Thank you kindly for any responses, and I'll do my best to expidiciously respond to any questions you may have.

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[dcotter0579]

Put the front end up on good solid jackstands and run the wheels up to speed. Then listen for the noise. You should be able to narrow down the area with much greater precision. If the noise goes away, then suspect the other wheel bearing.
Be careful.

[Lucutious]

Originally Posted by dcotter0579

Put the front end up on good solid jackstands and run the wheels up to speed. Then listen for the noise. You should be able to narrow down the area with much greater precision. If the noise goes away, then suspect the other wheel bearing.
Be careful.

I did precisely what you said. I did it pretty low so in case there was a safety issue the car wouldn't be falling very far (1 inch or so) and the only thing that would get damaged would be the car and/or jack stands.

With the spedometer reading 20-30 miles per hour, the sound was there - but a different pitch. I assume the pitch difference was because the wheels were off the ground and thus encountered much less resistance.

What is interesting to me is when I put the wheels up to speed and turned the steering wheel the sound did not attenuate like it does with the wheels on the ground. I turned the wheels all the way to the right and left and the only difference in sound is when I briefly hit the stops on either side.

In the interest of a full investigation, I tried this experiment in all gears provided - Reverse, Drive, 3rd gear, and Low gear. The sound was present in all of them, and the wheels turning left and right didn't change anything. When in reverse, the sound was a little different, a lower pitch - but still approximately the same volume.

Does that tell you anything at all?

Additionally, my father was on the outside of the vehicle. He put his ear near the left side and then the right side wheel while they were at speed and he could not tell a difference in sound.

Thanks in advance for any advise you can supply.

[dcotter0579]

Find a place with a wall that runs parallel to the road. Could be a building or a retaining wall or even a tall curb, preferrably where you can drive by in both directions.
Roll the windows down and drive by the wall and listen. You should be able to hear the echo off the wall. This should give you an indication of which side is worse. If your dad's hearing is suspect, then have him drive and you do the listening.
If you still can't locate the noise, maybe you'll need to get a mechanic to put it up on a hoist and listen with a mechanic's stethoscope.
Bearing noises are hard to find. (Impossible via long distanvce over the internet.) My first car had a noise that everybody insisted was a bad (rear) differential when it turned out to be a bad front wheel bearing.

[Lucutious]

Originally Posted by dcotter0579

Find a place with a wall that runs parallel to the road. Could be a building or a retaining wall or even a tall curb, preferrably where you can drive by in both directions.
Roll the windows down and drive by the wall and listen. You should be able to hear the echo off the wall. This should give you an indication of which side is worse. If your dad's hearing is suspect, then have him drive and you do the listening.
If you still can't locate the noise, maybe you'll need to get a mechanic to put it up on a hoist and listen with a mechanic's stethoscope.
Bearing noises are hard to find. (Impossible via long distanvce over the internet.) My first car had a noise that everybody insisted was a bad (rear) differential when it turned out to be a bad front wheel bearing.

Any diagnostics will be difficult over the internet, but I do sincerely appreciate your assistance anyways!

I have a highway interchange that has walls on both sides, 2 lanes. I can give your suggestion a try tomorrow - Sunday traffic in that part of town should allow me to swap lanes quickly so I can hear the difference between the two.

The vehicle has 89k miles on it, so I may follow my father's advise and replace the other bearing as well. That way at least I know I have 2 good bearings up front.

Here's a question about wheel bearings specifically: Are they notorious for being bad out of the box? The person who put on the left front bearing recently said that he's had instances where he put 3 or 4 new bearings on only for them to be bad as well.

The business side of my head tells me a company can't stay in business if it produces bad product, but the mechanical side of my head tells me that my experience with bearings is that they are a pain in the rear and maybe it is true.

*sigh* This problem may end up costing me a pretty penny...

[teddysmith1952]

Good exchange here. I know how frustrating these "noises" can be. The two most probable things I can think of that are affected by weight resistance on the front end when driving and turning would be the wheel bearings and CV joints.

[dcotter0579]

Bearings can be ruined by poor installation technique. People have been known to try to hammer them in to place. Guess what that does.