96 Concorde 3.5L driving me nuts
 

My GF's car, sometimes it will not start, maybe like 10% of the time...

The Dealership replaced the PCM twice, but this last time said the PCM was fine. They said the upstream O2 sensors, EGR valve and intake gasket needed to be replaced.

I did all that this past Saturday. Sunday morning the car would not start. You could crank and crank and get the plugs flooded, tons of spark, but it would not start.

Finally, when my dad was cranking it, I put my hand over the plastic intake manifold that connects the air clearner to the throttle bodies to choke it, it fired right up...

I decided it must be an airflow issue...

Since there was no check engine light on, I replced the Air Idle Control Valve and not the MAP, and once I did that the car started wonderful, with more RPM upon startup that the previous few months (it was starking very "weak" the past few months). The plunger on the old idle control valve was stuck out, and all carboned up... It seemed like I had it fixed.

She went to start the car this morning (about 15 degress F this morning), the car displayed the same symptoms...

What the hell???

RE: 96 Concorde 3.5L driving me nuts
 

take it back to the dealer and have then look at and and charge u for a checkout because u are going to do thework youself

RE: 96 Concorde 3.5L driving me nuts
 

It was just at the dealer, they did a check, and charged me $140 for it...

Upstream O2
HEGR
Intake gasket
Leaking transmission cooler lines

I fixed all those plus a rusted out power steering line, and the Idle Air Control Valve (IACV) which was stuck in the extended position...

Does the MAP sensor tell the IACV what to do, or does the PCM?

The last time it was at the dealer, they said the car was too old for their software to properly check out the electrical system, sounded like a line of BS to me...

I really thought I had it fixed when I replaced that valve...

RE: 96 Concorde 3.5L driving me nuts
 

yeah that is a BS there is a card which all dealers should have i know ours does have 3 of them.
it will hook up to the car back to 96 and b4. whast was the 140 for???

RE: 96 Concorde 3.5L driving me nuts
 

$140 Canadian was for the PCM check, the tech looked over the engine and pointed out all the problems. Guess that did not include a scan, just a visual check... The tech manager said they might not have the software for this car. The car came back to me with all the EGR hoses unplugged, and both upstream O2 sensors unplugged, so the check engine light was on when my GF brought it to me...

The $140 also included the cost of a tow, they would not pay for it because it was not the PCM again...

I've spent $500 on this thing this weekend, and now a new MAP is gonna cost me $100...

You think I should replace the MAP eventhough the check engine light is not on? Something is not properly controlling that Idle Air Valve...

RE: 96 Concorde 3.5L driving me nuts
 

are pretty much throwing money at nothing. Take it to a real dealer and just have them look at it being ot of the states that might be a prob u are pretty much out of luck.

RE: 96 Concorde 3.5L driving me nuts
 

Well I live in the States, she is in Canada...

Anyways, I just put the new MAP sensor on ($70 not $100), didn't change anything...

The only way I got it started was to have my GF put the accelerator full to the floor while I choked the intake tube with my hand to the air plenum, it started after about 20 seconds...

I just put a new fuel pump in it a month ago, and a new fuel filter last Sat. I know it's getting plenty of fuel when I don't choke it, as the plugs get wet just trying to start it normal...

The thing is it only does this once in a while, not everytime you try to start it...

After we got it running, we immediately shut the engine off, it starts right up like normal everytime now after you get it running initially...

I don't get it....

I could try to take it to a dealer, but when we do that that say they can't diagnose it if it's not displaying the problem... It only displays the problem very randomly, maybe once every five days or so... The last dealer that had it had the car for a week, trying to start it every day, it never had the problem...

Last time the dealer came to pick it up, it started after a whole weekend of not starting, so I had to pay for the damn tow...

RE: 96 Concorde 3.5L driving me nuts
 

How do I check fuel pressure?

RE: 96 Concorde 3.5L driving me nuts
 

with a a fuel pressure guage