Motor noise/whine after switch-off.
 

Lately I've noticed an obvious electric motor whine from under my 2006 diesel 2.8 Grand Voyager, round about the middle area. It stops after approx. one minute. There is no other fault. Anyone know what this is? My previous car, a diesel S-type Jag. did exactly the same.

Leedsman.

Auxiliary heater, look for a mini-exhaust pipe underneath near to the area of noise. And congrats, if you have an extra heater that costs a fortune in the UK. The extra minute is the emptying of the swirl bowl of unspent fuel after switching off.

VERY much obliged for this information Quinteq. Can you say what is heated by this, is it the interior or the engine? I read the red link and your comments -- as it must be burning white diesel from the tank, I don't really need it and I've not noticed any heat inside (I think I would have at 5Kw!). It certainly doesn't warm up the engine. Oh, that reminds me, -- the thermostat mods are still working perfectly, and I forgot to acknowledge your nice 'engine-turned ' version Quinteq, aplogies for the oversight.

On a separate issue, while I'm rattling the keyboard, anyone know how to disable the EGR valve simply so I can run some fuel consumption tests? I noticed the other day during murky weather that there is a touch of smoke from the exhaust on hard acceleration as shown in the light from car headlights behind. I have read from others with this 1st. gen. 2.8 diesel with solenoid injectors that this slight smoke is normal for this engine.

Leedsman.
p.s. Er...BTW, just how much is this extra heater worth? Go on, cheer me up.

HiYa Leedsman, I haven't got one hence, even with another Yourkshire-man I envy the fact that you do have one. I know Chrysler fitted Webasto made water coolant pre-heaters to your year. There's a one here for £120 on flea-bay. The origin of the idea was if it fell to say 20° C the pre-heater would 'start-up' and protect your coolant system, even in the middle of the night.

My Brother and I both have an Erberspatcher Airtronic D5's to heat our workshop[s] - these blow hot air. Along with your considered 'winterising' of your car, if this works on the front coolant you might want to consider that as it gets towards our UK winter this will come on in the morning start up and bring benefits by raising your coolant up to temp quicker than you could do it without the Webasto.

My brother had a new 8 seater Ford Galaxy [same as Sharan & Alhambra's] that had an auxiliary heater, the engine ran so cold that they fitted an Erberspatcher that heated coolant to a rear heater matrix, that engine was so cold if you drove 100 miles and parked up with the hot engine still on tickover the engine would turn cold so quickly you had to turn the fan off or lose a limb to frostbite. I'm not sure how the Chrysler one works, ie front rad / matrix or rear matrix only. I'm sure someone here will know and answer your questions. Meanwhile read this on the Ford one.

I have one of these heaters on my XS model! It heats the cabin! When I turn it on there are 3 yellow snake like lights that come on the dash! When I turn off the engine you can hear it still going! Kinda sounds like a jet turbine powering down! I can see the exhaust smoke from the diesel it uses! I've run mine on V-Power with Archoil and BG244 in the tank...

Thanks guys for this; I've noticed a new-ish light comes on in the fascia, some wiggly yellow lines pointing upwards in bottom centre of fascia. I assumed it was demister lights as that's what they look like. If I switch off the ordinary heater they disappear.
So if I switch on the ordinary heater immediate from starting cold engine, will these wiggly yellow lines indicate the Webasto heater in "on"? (Provided of course that it's cold outside, and provided the Webasto is working...)
This is fascinating. If it is working, I could use red diesel instead of white for the Webasto as this is proven legal with customs and excercise. (It's ok to use red which is a lot cheaper and easily available in Leeds from petrol stations, so long as you don't burn it in the engine). I've downloaded the picture from Fl-ebay provided by Quinteq to compare with mine.

Watch this space...

Leedsman.

According to the handbook, I've got an auxillary on my 2007 Executive. I discovered this when the light with the 3 wiggly lines came on and I had to refer to the handbook to find out what they were. But from what I understand from this post, the auxillary heater is fuelled from a seperate tank to the main one. Is this correct?
Incidentally, my last Voyager, which was a 2004 2.5 TD, also had an auxillary heater but I'm pretty sure it didn't have the light with the wiggly lines in the instrument display.

No, the aux. heater won't be fuelled from a separate tank, I was just getting ahead of myself here, thinking I could fit a red diesel sep. tank to save burning the ultra-expensive white tax-paid diesel. It's very easy in Leeds to buy small quantities of red.
As far a I can tell, one has to actually drive the vehicle before the aux. heater will come on. The "book" is not very clear on this.

Thanks for this further contribution.

Leedsman.

I was forgetting you're a Yorkshireman :O)
I wonder if the fitting of the indicator light was an afterthought by Chrysler. My 2004 didn't have a light but I'm sure it had an auxillary heater, I had the noises after switching off and the little pipe under the nearside that sometimes dripped water. Plus I remember the dealer mentioning it when I first picked the car up.

When ever I turn my heating on(If the cab is not at the set temp, say 71) then the 3 amber orange snake lights(Or arrows if you like) come on! Didn't know you could switch it off! The exhaust pip for my heater is really long! Was expecting a short snub nose one tbh. B4 I started to use V-Power derv it smoked and smelt a lot! But now doesn't ��

I'm giving Shell's V-power diesel a run for three months or so to see if it has any effect on fuel consumption. I tried BP's version on the diesel Jag., but it made no noticeable difference. The Jag's injectors were piezoelectric, this 2006 GV. is solenoid-magnetic. The later GVs are piezoelectric, (I think after 2011), plus an extra 15 horses to drag you along. If my injectors are a little clogged, it should improve the mpg fig. If not, it's 40p per gallonUK extra for naught (or nowt if you live in Yorkshire).

Leedsman.

The 3 yellow arrows in a square box is the rear window [10 minutes then it switches off] defroster - our American cousins call it a defogger. The 3 yellow arrows NOT in a square box on the extreme right of the curved information bar as far as I'm aware is just to tell you you have switched on the heating.

I tried the expensive Shell V-Power Nitro+ Diesel for three tanks and it made no difference to MPG, mind you I have the same 33MPG mixed regardless of use and no blue smoke. Whether the Nitro+ has the capacity to reduce deposits on the injectors and improve spray patterns leading to better performance I've always considered a Paul Daniels outcome.

I'm not that bothered if V-Power gives me more mpg! Would be nice all the same if this GTL(Gas To Liquid) semi synth fuel did! I'm more interested in the double additive package that should help maintain the fuel system.

Try using some low ash 2T (2 stroke) oil in the fuel! Burns cleaner than diesel and lubes the fuel system! Cheap in Morrisons and Wilko's!

I must say that I've only ever used V-Power in my Toyota T-180 and I get better mpg! This could be because I run a K&N air filter along with a £485 Tunit box! Who knows! But using a top quality fuel must have a difference! It's the same as us eating crap food and expecting to remain health! Not gonna happen! Same with the life blood of our engine! Use crap oil and it might save you pennies now! But could cost thousands in the long run!!!

Token expired.
 

I've taken TimmyTim's advice and have installed 2--stroke low ash oil in the fuel tank at a ratio of about 250:1. I'll report my findings in due course. I tried a small amount of acetone some time ago in the Jag's fuel tank, and it made no difference to anything.
Money:
£1:50 per 250ml. serving.

Leedsman.

Token test for errors.

Will be great to hear what you think of it. Lots have reported on other forums that the engine runs smother! Just remember to use the low ash mineral 2T oil and not the semi or full synth one. Basically the cheapest oil you can find. I did have a bottle here somewhere with the Numbers on! I remember the one from Wilko's was green in color and about 3 quid for 500ml...

The three wiggly yellow lines (or snakes) have no little box around them, but they are located bottom centre of fascia display next the MIL light, the one that looks like an engine.

I'm very pleased to report that today with ambient temps around 0*C, the heater warmed up quickly, and the cyl. head temperature gauge I fitted seems to like hovering around 82*C. But with such a big mini-van, it does take a while to heat up all that space. If anyone wants details of this temp. gauge I fitted, just say so. It's cheap and easy to fit, anyone could do it. No drilling, not even a connection to the electrics!

Leedsman.

Re. adding 2--stroke oil to fuel; bit early to tell as yet, but a kind of faint "howling" from the engine under full pulling power seems to have disappeared. That's all so far.

Leedsman.

Would be great to hear your results on this mate!

A Yorkshire-man's test for engine 'noise' balance

- without
- with
- its only a video, but listen attentively - its very audible as well as visible

I've never tried bg244 although I read the Merc Test White Papers years ago, and have always been sceptical about claims that it clogs up the hated DPF. However the old 'thrash~the~ash' does not work in automatic cars unless you are prepared to do miles in a locked low gear on a hot engine. The $hiΓe that is legal, political and regulatory is generally bad for the motorist and always hits the taxpayer in the pocket - or in this case the engine.

[QUOTE=Leedsman;74851]Re. adding 2--stroke oil to fuel; bit early to tell as yet, but a kind of faint "howling" from the engine

An excellent a--b test from these two little videos. On my B&W* speakers and my hearing there seems to be a distinct reduction of noise in the lower-midrange, say abt. 200Hz to 500Hz approx. There was also obvious reduction in general diesel clatter at idle. The glass of water indicated less vibration at idle too.

So what is this BG244, some kind of cetane lifter?

Leedsman.

* Of course I only use these speakers on the computer. For serious listening I have Leak "Sandwich" with 12" bass driver and Goodmans Magnum "Ks". Both from the 1970s and original cones. I have modified the bass ends by converting from infinite baffle to cavity resonant -- tuned of course to just below the unit's bass resonance. The crossovers in the Leaks were good, but the Goodmans not -- fixed that PDQ.

Sounds like result to me! Happy days... BG244 has a high amount of POA( if memory serves) take a look on the powerenhancer web site. Very good stuff! :)

Yep ! Cetane, is simply the measure of the ignition quality of diesel fuel, and it 'lifts' it. Costing about £20 for 110 litre treatments its expensive with a tank size of 75.7 litres / 16.7 gallons. At £5 per 6 gallons its a bit salty. For myself however there are two user types those with and those without a problem, and I don't have one. The cetane in our UK forecourt fuels has been considerably reduced by the politicians and piggin greenies in the lobby groups, the current EN590 moved an optimum Cetane per the VM engine and fuel parameters design .. .. to a marginally adequate UK compromise in recent years. Notwithstanding those comments I've always thought that benefits of BG 248 that treats anti-waxing, detergent, oxidation resistance, vapour pressure and lubricity were more important that the Cetane rating per se.

I am however in that camp of 'enquiring minds' that's prepared to speculate a one off £20 or £40 providing I can get measured non-emotional objective measurements and there's the rub. Without purpose designed test rigs that's never going to be the case. So I'm left as I was years ago when the Merc Test White Papers were around knowing that a purely subjective test would have no validity. It would be true that cars of a year or two old [less subjective test] that modern diesels are quieter will have had this issue 'designed out', in my case my car is now 8 years but still low mileage, still the EEPROM is of an 8 year old design and would not know in tech-terms whether it was a packman or a playstation when determining detonation, combustion speed, the timing compromises of 'compromised' fuel.

Shell - FuelSave & Shell V-Power will now [usually middle Nov to middle march] have been EN590 adjusted for 'winter motoring' [see lubricity & Cetane] The cabbage & turnips the tree huggers and sandal wearers are pouring into our fuel tanks is here at £50 per copy I can't refer you to the results for the 2013 EN590.

I await your test results.

Thanks Quinteq, I seem to remember last time I was in Leeds' Halfords there was a product by "Miller's Oils" said on the tin to contain cetane improver. I thought the stuff coming out of the pumps was around c50 these days but my data could be out of date now. Anyone know the actual pump figure?
Interestingly, the americans being so good at high speed photography, have managed to show a picture of the actual ignition delay in a real engine -- one can just see the slight gap between injector tip and the start of the burn. It was some time ago and I don't have details how to access this picture, although I'll bet someone on here will.
But pertinent to winter diesel adjustment from the pumps, the de-waxing process reduces the cetane rating, as many of these cetane numbers are in the low-temp. waxes when still liquid in summer. This could be another factor in the increase of diesel fuel consumption during cold weather.

Leedsman.

I've just had a look on Halfords and the Millers on their site is lead / petrol, the diesel on Halfords is not listed as diesel but as 'VSPe'. The Millers own site lists it as 'DIESEL POWER ECOMAX' but when you read what they claim to be their Technical Datasheet it gives no real data so I wouldn't touch it with a bargepole.

Look the Millers might be brill it might be carp who knows they cant be arrased to put up a spec sheet so why would I trust them when the makers of BG 248 are prepared to be held to account by publishing their data. PEA is NANO and in any concentrations is expensive stuff its real Archoil name is AR6200 and the price of any brand is linear to the amount of expensive PEA.

Take care lad !