Here's what is going on:
-Last week, van wouldn't start, acted like a dead battery. I took battery back to store (was only 3 months old), they checked it, said it was a dead cell and gave me a new one.
-installed new battery, still nothing. Starter won't even turn. Removed starter, took it to parts store, they checked it and said the solenoid was bad. I bought new one, installed it, and still same problem. Seem to have possibly narrowed it to this:

1. Have 12Vdc at starter large diameter wire

2. Have 0Vdc at solenoid wire (small diameter wire at starter) with key to start

3. At relay prong 86 (on starter relay next to battery), have 12Vdc (from prong hole to battery ground) with key to start.

My assumption:
The wire from starter relay to the starter solenoid is "bad".

Assuming that the wire didn't come off the bottom of the relay box, or it's not severly corroded:
Is it a direct connection?
Can I just replace the wire (if so, which one actually is it that connects to the relay?)

Lastly, how do I get to the wires under the relay box?

 

Try this frist jump pin 30 and 87 that is a direct connection to the starter see if it turns over then get back to me. ALso check the fuses for the power supply.

 

First off, let me say Thank You for your help.

How do I jumper 30 to 87 without shocking myself? I am not an electrical expert, so still "respect" it enough to want to be sure of what I am doing first.

I did have a blown fuse (fuse 9?) in the circuit from contact 30 to the battery (not sure if it was related). Replaced it, and still not starting.

I have verified I have constant power at contact 30 using a voltmeter. I have a drawing showing that power comes from the key switch to contact 86 (with key to start) through the relay and out via contact 85 (where does that wire go? and what does it do?). On the "other side" of the starter relay, the power comes straight from the battery to contact 30 and when the relay is enegized via contact 86/85 it completes the circuit via contact 87 to the starter solenoid.

 

I jumpered across pins 30 & 87 in the Engine starter motor relay and did get power to the solenoid doing that. So, that leaves the question, why isn’t the relay causing the “switch� between 30 & 87 to shut? I have a drawing of the circuit, and it shows the relay, and like I stated before I have power at pin 86 with the key to start. So, whatever is supposed to complete the circuit at pin 85 appears to be the problem. It shows it going to the “double start override� in the powertrain control module, just not sure what that is or how to correct the problem.

 

I talked to a guy over the phone yesterday same issue u have. The wire diagrams u guys get arnt full what is not there is that the Front controller is what closes the contacts to the starter relay. SO if u are able to move the starter when u jump pin 87 and 30 u have a control issue on pin 85. U have a front coontroler issue or an IPM aka fuse block issue.

 

Is the front controller a dealer onlypart (if so, do you know approx. cost)? Or can I get one from a junk yard? The fuse block (IPM) should be fine from a junk yard right?

Also, doesn't jumping across pin 87 to 30 just esentially bypass the relay? If so, then how can you be certain the PCM isn't the problem by not providing the "ground" to the circuit via pin 85?

 

I would not get a front controller from a junk yard IPM yeah ok.
are u missing ground at pin 85? or power at pin 86?

 

I am missing ground at 85.

Do you happen to know how much a front controller should cost? Are they only available from the dealer or can I get one at Advance or Autozone or Napa?

 

no u cant get one from any place but dealer I would rule out the IPM first. flip the IPM over and locate the wire to pcm that controles the ground to the Relay see if u get the ground at the connector if its there then U know u need an IPM.