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missing, bucking running rich

  #1  
Old 03-29-2012, 05:06 AM
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Default missing, bucking running rich

okay, let me set the tone...
several months ago i had to replace the pcm on our 03 town and country 3.3l. it wouldnt start periodically and would die randomly. the pcm was dropping the ground for different circuits (starter, fuel, etc). after i replaced the pcm, it ran great for a few months. now we have another problem. wife was driving home one day from about a 7 mile trip, and it started running extremely rough, almost to the point of dying on her on the road. she pulled it into the gas station and let it sit till i went and looked at it. when i started it up, it was running very rich, and almost would not stay running. there was a P108 code and later on we also got a P1297 code. i changed the plug wires (because i pulled one out of the boot when i took it off the plug, but they were due anyway), and bought a new map sensor for it. i also put a new coil pack on. none of this helped. i was leaving on a trip, so i took it to the "local dealership" (which i am totally opposed to) and let them deal with it, knowing full well i was gonna get raped. here is what they did: changed the plugs, ran a compression test on 2, 4, and 6 cylinders, changed the pcv valve. at this point the bill was already $225 and it wasnt fixed yet. i told them to pull it outside and i would come pick it up. their reccomendations: change the plug wires and the coil!! really???? this is why i hate dealerships. anyway, if anyone out there has any suggestions, i would be glad to entertain them. oh, btw, i already checked all the wiring from the map sensor to the pcm and it all looks great; no chaffing or broken insulation anywhere. thanks in advance!!
 
  #2  
Old 03-30-2012, 02:17 AM
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Shock of shocks on your dealership visit. Unfortunately crap like that is becoming the norm.

Both codes are pointing to the MAP sensor. Doesn't nessesarily mean the map sensor is bad as you found out. Is it getting the reference voltage? Did you check wire continuity with a meter and not just visually?

P0108 Manifold Absolute Pressure/Barometric Pressure Circuit High Input

Part 1 -Chrysler MAP Sensor Test (3 Wire Sensor) P0107, P0108.
 

Last edited by Raptor 07; 03-30-2012 at 02:42 AM.
  #3  
Old 03-30-2012, 07:50 AM
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raptor....
thanks for the reply. yes, i ohmed from the map sensor down to the 10 pin connector behind the coil, then from the 10 pin connector to the pcm, then connected the 10 pin and ohmed from the map sensor to the pcm. all was good. i am going to tear into it today, but im starting to wonder if the timing chain jumped a tooth, because it sounds now like there could be a bent valve in on the aft bank of cylinders....im going to do a compression check of the "hard" ones today since the dealership only checked 2,4,and 6. it has 135000 miles on it, and never had a new timing chain....ill let u know what i find..............UGH!!!
BTW..........isnt 71 bucks for a set of plugs a little high?? maybe i am just being a jerk, but maybe the mopar plugs are made of gold?
 
  #4  
Old 03-30-2012, 07:52 AM
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sorry, i didnt answer your other question........yes, i back pinned the map connector and the reference voltage fluctuates up and down with a change of vacuum in the motor. of course, since the motor is running so bad, it takes a pretty large rev to change that vacuum. but yes...it seems to be funcioning normally.
 
  #5  
Old 03-30-2012, 10:01 AM
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open hood find the coil pack on the right hand side reach around or look with a flash light there will be a 10 way connector tan I think look at the wire on both ends they are more then likely melted together.
 
  #6  
Old 03-31-2012, 08:11 AM
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Originally Posted by CHRYSLER TECH View Post
open hood find the coil pack on the right hand side reach around or look with a flash light there will be a 10 way connector tan I think look at the wire on both ends they are more then likely melted together.
i had already checked all that before i took it in to the dealership, and it was all good. what i had a problem with is why they only checked 3 cylinders for compression. i checked them myself last night, and guess what? #5 cylinder had no compression! none. tore it all apart and i have a broken exhaust valve spring on #5. wow, really? this just reaffirms my life rule of never taking anything into a dealership because most of them are thieves who actually know little about troubleshooting a car. and they call themselves "techs". maybe this is just one dealership, but i doubt it. ive dealt with gm dealerships who were the same way. never again!! anyway, im hoping the inner spring held the valve up enough so that it didnt hit the piston!! we'll see later today.......
 
  #7  
Old 03-31-2012, 02:40 PM
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Again, I'm shocked.

The only time I take any of my vehicles to any dealership is for a recall or warranty work and then I check it over with a fine tooth comb when I get it back. Years ago I took my GC in for a cooling fan relay recall. Got it back and found a 6 inch extension with attached socket laying in the engine bay. I called them and thanked them for the present... among other things. Got a screw driver from Toyota a few years ago. Was stuck under the top of a floor mat. I like free stuff.

Ya, a dropped valve would sure do it. A vacuum gauge would have probably been bouncing and low. Great job! Hope that's all you have.
 

Last edited by Raptor 07; 03-31-2012 at 02:44 PM.
  #8  
Old 03-31-2012, 08:44 PM
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well, my fears are confirmed.....valve dropped low enough to contact the cast aluminum piston, and crack the piston head. *SIGH*. Do i fix it, or give up and look for something else?? i hate this van!! by the time i buy new head gasket, piston, possibly a rod, rings, spring, etc, etc....is it really worth it?
 
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