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00 t&c fwd 3.8l p1391

Old 08-28-2009, 04:38 PM
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Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 2
Exclamation 00 t&c fwd 3.8l p1391

I am new to the forums, and hope I may offer my expetise where needed. after spending 2 or so hours searching the forums, I decided to register.
I'll introduce myself a bit; I am an ASE certified tech with over 7yrs doing this professionally. I run a mobile repair service in my area. While I specialize in Euro and Aisan vehicles, I've been in the ring with many Chryslers. This one is about to knock me outta the ring soon.
I am having a serious issues with the "family mobile"

00 T&C SWB FWD LXi 3.8L ~17X,000 miles
Vehicle exhibited bucking/jerking while driving about 3 months ago. As time went on, it became undriveable. MIL on code P1391 - CMP/CKP signal loss
Replaced both sensors with ones from Advance Auto BWD to be exact. No change.

Using a bore scope, viewed reluctor wheels for both sensors - no problems found.

Knowing some aftermarket sensors are junk, I replaced them again with OEM Dealer parts. No change

Stopped into a friends shop yesterday for some advise, I was driving the van to get a better feel for when and how long it would have it's problem. I do not drive this car often, it's the wife's. Leaving the shop with no usefull info, the van started driving better than it ever has. No bucking or anything. Ran like an 09 model. Drove to a customers house for an estimate it was fine. I left and started driving home, came to an intersection that required a little extra oomph to get into traffic safely. It shut off soon as I was turning. I pulled off and started looking for anything obvious.Ended up being towed home.

Now It is still refusing to start. I borrowed a scope from a friend. Checked the wave forms and they are for the most part, good. Few iffy spots, but it should run with those signals. If I can find a wayto get the data from te scope to the computer,I'll post it.
All the van will do is turn over, occasionaly sputter. No real start. I have checked the wiring found some iffy spots.
After studying the wiring diagrams, I cut the connectors from the harness and wired straight to ECU plugs. Even replaced wire going from CKP signal to TCM I just tapped my new sensor gnd into the wire at ECU. I cut( about 4" away from ECU Plugs) +8V and CKP Signal and CMP Signal then wired my new harness straight to the ECU. I did this to avoid any interference from factory harness potential problems.

This has changed nothing. Except cost me several hours of my time.
I have also checked the pins going into the ECU, all checked OK. I ran a ground wire from ECU case to chassis just incase.

I have been able to get a variation in cranking and starting attempts by changing the air gap on the CKP & CMP sensors. But still no true start.

I am at wits end with this one, and am getting close to arsen of my own property. Needless to say my wife is not happy with the no car situation. I need a resolution. Any help is greatly appreciated.
And to all who respond, Thank you!
If you have any ideas or advice, the quickest way to reach me is via my cell phone; 717-203-2483 or my email; [email protected]

I am located 20 minutes North of Lancaster City, Pennsylvania.

Thanks again,
Old 08-28-2009, 10:28 PM
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Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Norcross GA
Posts: 8,114

any other codes other then 1391? I know u have stuff like a power probe or a test light and volt meter right? lets see what U are missing spark,fuel 5v from the sensor and so on.

Check for spark yes or no then get back to me
Old 08-29-2009, 09:03 AM
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 2

Yes, I have tested for spark and fuel. I did a full tune up about a year ago. I hooked up the Snap On Vantage Pro to both CKP and CMP waves look good. The 5V Signal is good. I am going to bypass ASD relay, and see if I can get her to run, even if it runs rough It's a start. I'll verify proper operation of ASD first though. Also no other codes. And my MODIS is out for repairs so all I have is a glorified code reader and the borrowed vantage pro.

Also,Chrysler Tech, If you get a minute would you be able to call me? I don't know any chrysler guys up here.

Thanks again.
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