Chrysler Voyager & Town & Country The first and foremost name in minivans leading the class since their inception in the 1980s

T & C Auto Transmission - HELP please

  #1  
Old 11-04-2009, 01:23 PM
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Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: UK
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Default T & C Auto Transmission - HELP please

I hope someone can help....please. Sorry for the long post but wanted to give you as much info as poss.

31st Oct - 2005 Grand Voyager Auto which, when travelling at around 60mph, the revs suddenly increase, with no power to the engine - eg like its dropped out of gear / no engine resistance. Quite worrying / dangerous if theres suddenly no power and someone is up your tail.

Of course as it suddenly revs up, the normal reaction is to take foot off the accel pedal, the revs drop and it changes gear, power resumes. It will do it again and again over a few mins, then it'll seem fine.

Tested it on the following day, going up to 80mphish, and varying slow to fast, no probs at all, all day.

Transmission fluid at normal levels. Just under 50K on the clock.

A diagnostic was booked in today, had to travel on a main road. Lost concentration for a sec while travelling at 60mph, and the gear dropped, trhe revs shot into the max, 5k redline. Engine warning light came on. Very worrying, thought I'd seriously messed up the engine.

Eventually got there....
Fault P Code P0884 found, ECM / TCM software required.
TCM Power Input Signal Intermittent

The garage told me they wiped out the old software and reloaded new with updates etc. Same thing occurred, probably worse.

Symptoms -

No speedo movement. (and revving to 3k at 30-50mph)

Dropping gears as above , only moreso.

Revving to 3k and staying in same gear, probably 3rd at say 40 - 50mph

All figures illuminated with a highlight square, eg P R D 3 L etc

Engine then quit totally, ie no power in D. R had power so did 3 & L.

Then worked fine enough to get me home the last half mile.

Then sometimes some speedo movement.

Pretty worried it is gearbox, but possibly computer related only? What do you think guys - have you seen or heard of this sort of thing before?

When I got home I also did the key P code test, and got P1685 - 'smart key immobilier module has received an invalid key'. Never had this before, seems strange.

Your help and advice would be greatly appreciated. Thanks
 

Last edited by Baja Jeep; 11-04-2009 at 01:35 PM.
  #2  
Old 11-07-2009, 07:08 PM
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Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 369
Default

You need a real scanner able to read trans computer information. Sure looks like trans rebuild time. If you completely disable the electrical system it will still have 2nd gear. If your driving and it just drops out and flairs isn't an electrical problem. It's internal
 
  #3  
Old 11-10-2009, 12:00 AM
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Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: UK
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Default

Hi Guys,
Some feedback for you on this one. Please bear with this long one..tis good..

After the diagnostic mentioned above (P0884 -'TCM Power Input Signal Intermittent') took the car (with difficulty at 20mph and 2nd gear at 2k revs) to a friend mechanic that has been working on some of my cars for around 18 years.
After reading all your advice, we spent some time routing around the TCM under left wheel arch, the relays above rad, and the wiring loom around the IPM areas etc.
We checked the wiring loom for broken wires (opening tape and shielding), chaffing, and the connectors. Nothing broken that we could see.
As we routed around, and also unplugged and plugged the connector plug from the TCM, a relay could be heard tripping in and out - every so often. It was almost random, not consistent, even though we tried to be systematic with limiting movement of the loom.
It was from one of the relays above the rad. Not the three rad ones on the left or the grey glow plug relay on the right - but the one next to it. (Believe it is the TCM relay, though this particular relay was not shown on the workshop manual diagram).
We swapped it for one of the other black ones, same thing occured, potentially ruling out a faulty relay.
After routing for a while we could not hear the clicking relay any more. Test run the car, same gear issue occurred.
Disappointed we could not resolve this, friend suggested booking it in to auto electrian specialist to check the circuits etc.
Just as we were closing up, we nudged the battery ever so slightly, the clicking came on and off.....Wait for it...


The eyelet cable connection that sits next to the main cable off the postive terminal was loose, ie the nut was loose, allowing the connection to trip on and off with vibrations and movement.
This was the cause of the tripping relay. Took it for a test drive and it did not skip a beat. A further drive of 20 odd miles, and not one problem with the gears.
Success.

Now here are some of my concerns.....
What procedures were followed after the P0884 code was determined?
ie - was a visual inspection / testing carried for circuits to the TCM for an open or short circuit by the engineer at the Chrysler dealership, as stated in the workshop manual? Would this not have been a good idea for any experienced engineer/ mechanic to check.

Why was the car booked in without an experienced Chrysler engineer in attendance or supervising?

Why had I not received a courtesy phonecall to explain that the car may not be ready that evening?.
An experienced Chrysler engineer would still not have been in attendance had the car been left overnight, which is what the dealer asked me to do..another story!

Why was a software reinstall necessary? This would still have not solved the issue, even if installed 20 times! ..................
............Incidentally, on return from leave, the experienced Chrysler Engineer called me (at my request last week) - and I questioned the procedure he would have taken, and that of the engineer who had carried out the diag and software install.
He stated that the software install would have been exactly what he would have done first also. Whether this is true or because he is a new employee (to this particular dealership) and would need to be seen to corroborate the other engineers story, is anyones guess.
What do you think guys, would not a visuals inspection have been a good idea, paricularly given the procedure stated in the manual - seems common sense in heinsight - it is in print afterall.

Considering that I was a new customer this certainly isn't the level of service I'd expected, particulalry as it was subsequently stated that the Chry dealer had only been operating for 2 months.
Needless to say very disappointed with that particular Chrysler dealership.

This could very easily have turned into a very expensive situation.
Moral - check the simplest things first, before jumping to advising new gearboxes, as the dealership had originally stated. A bit like the doc advising a new heart when you climb the stairs and are a bit out of breath:angry1:
 
  #4  
Old 12-30-2009, 06:32 AM
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Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 17
Smile I had similar now fixed

hi

I had a similar fault which happened to be a broken red wire under the fuse box where it goes into the front N/S wing to the foward control module see post: [url]https://www.chryslerforum.com/forum/showthread.php?t=7563

it was expensive only because labour cost in finding the fault hope it helps
 
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